EuropeBoard

Yahlia wrote:

South Korea is economically dependent on China but they don't have the red lines!

Every state has a logic to it. In this case South Korea simply cannot be influenced by China due to circumstance. The division of Korea into two halves means that anyone who influences one automatically cannot hope to influence the other since they become associated with "the enemy." And in the case of China, it just so happens that they're the only power propping up North Korea, which is why South Korea would be out of the question and naturally hostile to China. Maybe if the peninsula reunified, I would show the (now unified) Korean peninsula as being disputed between the West and China, but until that happens, the division of Korea will stop both Koreas from being influenced by the same power.

Yahlia wrote:

If you're saying that Turkey is definitively part of the West but that NZ and Australia are merely influenced by the West, then I think you have some flaws in your map >:(

I define "the West" as NATO and EU countries. Those are countries unquestionably locked down by the United States and used to project its power globally. With that out of the way, I can now explain why Turkey, despite recent events, is still part of the West (the countries doing the projecting).

Despite their recent "agreements" with Russia, Turkey hasn't been kicked out of NATO or any Western organization yet. The agreements right now aren't being done in the name of closer relations, but of reluctant convenience. By your own logic, I should be placing Russia under Chinese influence just because they have some strategic agreements to get out of each other's way.

Yahlia wrote:

Then why is Australia growing increasingly hostile to China? Surely if Beijing weilded this "alarming amount of influence", then Australia wouldn't be pushing back in this way. Yes, Oceania is economically dependent on China, but that doesn't mean when push comes to shove we'll roll over and submit

And yet despite this, Australia still decided to pull itself closer to China by signing off on things like the RCEP in late 2020, well beyond the point where relations had "deteriorated" between the two.

Until I see something concrete come out of Australia, I'm not going to say the West has gotten a victory from Australia doing minor things to oppose China. Despite the apparent hostility between the two, they still conduct business with each other (to the point where you could argue Australia has become dependent on China economically) and by the time regulations came down on China in 2020, it was too late.